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Post by futurerocker on Feb 4, 2019 16:39:27 GMT -5
"Fragile masculinity and a mansplaining joke" Yeah, this definitely worries me. Did not expect that from this movie at all. Didn't mind the whole joke with Fred trying to fill Daphne roll, but after hearing that I'm a little scared. Also disappointing to see a lack of Scrappy and Weird and Bogel. All three characters were a huge part of the series. Guess, I'll just have to wait and see on Tuesday. These are basically the same jokes they've been making about Fred since Pup. How many times has Fred "mansplained" the Mole People on that show? Where Are You played Fred so seriously that it made him an easy target for proxy jokes about 70s male chauvinism. I'm gonna have to disagree with you there. I don't even regard mansplained as a real word and I don't ever remember Fred ever being shown as thinking he was more superior than Velma or Daphne or women in general and I don"t understand why they are putting this in a cartoon. This isn't a platform to spread ideas like these and is just embarrassing.
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Post by jonathanmuddlemore on Feb 4, 2019 16:49:59 GMT -5
These are basically the same jokes they've been making about Fred since Pup. How many times has Fred "mansplained" the Mole People on that show? Where Are You played Fred so seriously that it made him an easy target for proxy jokes about 70s male chauvinism. I'm gonna have to disagree with you there. I don't even regard mansplained as a real word and I don't ever remember Fred ever being shown as thinking he was more superior than Velma or Daphne or women in general and I don"t understand why they are putting this in a cartoon. This isn't a platform to spread ideas like these and is just embarrassing. 1. There are no such thing as "real words". Every word we have started out as slang before gaining legitimacy through use. 2. Him being condescending to Daphne is the subtext of his character in Pup. Like this exchange: Fred: The Coolsville Stamp Collecting Club? What do they do? Daphne (sarcastically): Collect stamps, Freddy? Fred: Wow! You're really starting to get good at this mystery stuff! Also, there's a whole subplot in the first live-action movie where Fred has to learn to not hog all the credit from Velma. Again, it's a common satirical point made about Fred both within the franchise and outside of it.
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Post by scubidu on Feb 4, 2019 17:48:53 GMT -5
"Fragile masculinity and a mansplaining joke" Yeah, this definitely worries me. Did not expect that from this movie at all. Didn't mind the whole joke with Fred trying to fill Daphne roll, but after hearing that I'm a little scared. Also disappointing to see a lack of Scrappy and Weird and Bogel. All three characters were a huge part of the series. Guess, I'll just have to wait and see on Tuesday. These are basically the same jokes they've been making about Fred since Pup. How many times has Fred "mansplained" the Mole People on that show? Where Are You played Fred so seriously that it made him an easy target for proxy jokes about 70s male chauvinism. "mansplaning about mole people" def not a good example lol
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Post by futurerocker on Feb 4, 2019 19:13:11 GMT -5
I'm gonna have to disagree with you there. I don't even regard mansplained as a real word and I don't ever remember Fred ever being shown as thinking he was more superior than Velma or Daphne or women in general and I don"t understand why they are putting this in a cartoon. This isn't a platform to spread ideas like these and is just embarrassing. 1. There are no such thing as "real words". Every word we have started out as slang before gaining legitimacy through use. 2. Him being condescending to Daphne is the subtext of his character in Pup. Like this exchange: Fred: The Coolsville Stamp Collecting Club? What do they do? Daphne (sarcastically): Collect stamps, Freddy? Fred: Wow! You're really starting to get good at this mystery stuff! Also, there's a whole subplot in the first live-action movie where Fred has to learn to not hog all the credit from Velma. Again, it's a common satirical point made about Fred both within the franchise and outside of it. I still don't agree. I think your looking way to deep into these things. Fred not being condescending, he's being a kid. Kid think crazy things and are stupid. Those are two major characteristics of Fred in that series. He believed everything he heard and was always out of the loop and I don't see how he is being condescending in the example you gave me. They are new to the whole mystery thing and he is surprised how fast she was able to answer his question., which he didn't realize she was being sarcastic. I don't see anything condescending there and I thought the subplot in the live-action was suppose to be about how some people can let power and fame get to their head, not about Fred thinking he's better than every female.
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Post by jonathanmuddlemore on Feb 4, 2019 21:03:20 GMT -5
1. There are no such thing as "real words". Every word we have started out as slang before gaining legitimacy through use. 2. Him being condescending to Daphne is the subtext of his character in Pup. Like this exchange: Fred: The Coolsville Stamp Collecting Club? What do they do? Daphne (sarcastically): Collect stamps, Freddy? Fred: Wow! You're really starting to get good at this mystery stuff! Also, there's a whole subplot in the first live-action movie where Fred has to learn to not hog all the credit from Velma. Again, it's a common satirical point made about Fred both within the franchise and outside of it. I still don't agree. I think your looking way to deep into these things. Fred not being condescending, he's being a kid. Kid think crazy things and are stupid. Those are two major characteristics of Fred in that series. He believed everything he heard and was always out of the loop and I don't see how he is being condescending in the example you gave me. They are new to the whole mystery thing and he is surprised how fast she was able to answer his question., which he didn't realize she was being sarcastic. I don't see anything condescending there and I thought the subplot in the live-action was suppose to be about how some people can let power and fame get to their head, not about Fred thinking he's better than every female.
Daphne's snippy response to Fred (which I didn't include because I thought it was already obvious) clearly shows the intent of the scene was to make Fred look like a jerk. And on the live-action movie, Gunn's script uses audiences pre-conceived notions of the original cartoons as the basis for its comedy. When the movie shows smoke coming out of the Mystery Machine, the audience immediately recognizes it as a pot joke without the film needing to explain why. The purpose of Fred and Velma's story arc is to poke fun at how Fred's perceived leadership status contrasts with Velma being the most useful member. It's possible that no gendered subtext was intended but I think that's a naive reading. The film also parodies Daphne's "Damsel-in-Distress" reputation so it's not like the topic wasn't on Gunn's mind.
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Post by Chorake on Feb 4, 2019 21:13:20 GMT -5
Y'all are forgetting the very much engendered, chauvinist stuff in New Movies Freddy says hahahaha.
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Post by jonathanmuddlemore on Feb 4, 2019 21:17:15 GMT -5
Y'all are forgetting the very much engendered, chauvinist stuff in New Movies Freddy says hahahaha. THANK YOU! Everyone was a jerk on that show. I think Don Addams straight up made a women drivers joke at one point
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Post by ShaphneLegacy27 on Feb 5, 2019 12:20:33 GMT -5
Just sad because 2019 also marks the 40th anniversary of Scrappy. WB better be planning a sequel to resolve the return of Scrappy, Weerd and Bogel in their rebooted timeline if they ever want me to gain some sort of faith in them.
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Post by shaggyfan86 on Feb 5, 2019 13:59:12 GMT -5
Wow, worse film ever! If you loved all the 80s films and 13 ghosts series, ignore this film. On its own it would have been good but wow.
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Post by russm on Feb 5, 2019 14:25:56 GMT -5
Wow, worse film ever! If you loved all the 80s films and 13 ghosts series, ignore this film. On its own it would have been good but wow. Have you watched it?
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Post by shaggyfan86 on Feb 5, 2019 14:44:37 GMT -5
Wow, worse film ever! If you loved all the 80s films and 13 ghosts series, ignore this film. On its own it would have been good but wow. Have you watched it? Yes, if your a fan of the 80s films and 90s films you'll do yourself a favor and not watch it. Or at least stay away from the ending. I was extremely excited for the film but good flipping Mike.
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Post by candy1026 on Feb 5, 2019 16:05:34 GMT -5
Oksy so we're leaning no on Bogel and Weerd, which is a bummer. But looks like at bare minimum Scrappy is getting referenced. The way that review mentions it I get the impression he's clearly not got a role in the main plot, but there are still several different ways the film could explain why he's not there. Given it also says there are lots of easter eggs for 13 Ghosts fans, I think it's probably not that negative. Which to be honest Scrappy getting a full redemption here was always a overly expectant longshot. But some of us were worried he may have been ignored completely, so one step at a time.
Scoobnick, what do you mean by "redemption"? As in turning him good from evil? Or just bringing him back in general? Because the live action was kind of non canon and the second option isn't what redemption means.
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Post by scubidu on Feb 5, 2019 16:11:42 GMT -5
This movie was such a hype killer. It started great but things got really meh in the second half, kinda disrespectful I'd say. It has a lot of easter eggs from the 80s series, yeah, but it doesn't have its soul. Also, I thought WWE2 had fulfilled the quota of car chases for the next 10 years (sadly I was wrong, it was so boring and felt so disconected from the rest). It's a shame and now I'm worried about the Zombie Island sequel. Curse of the 13th Ghost had a good excuse to happen (finishing the tv series) and it turned out to be like this...What about Zombie Island, which has no obvious reason to get a sequel?
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Post by russm on Feb 5, 2019 16:32:13 GMT -5
Yes, if your a fan of the 80s films and 90s films you'll do yourself a favor and not watch it. Or at least stay away from the ending. I was extremely excited for the film but good flipping Mike. Never really cared much for 13 Ghosts. I'll get it when it comes out in the UK and it can go on my 'watch at some point' pile behind the gourmet DTV.
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Post by mattpricetime on Feb 5, 2019 16:44:10 GMT -5
Honestly I liked it quite a bit. There were some parts I didn't enjoy as much as in my head I had pre-thought out. I liked how it seemed like we got a closure ending but then Velma's end speech has basically cornered her from skeptic to pure cynic so I don't take her word seriously at all there.
In my head I was curious if this would be my favorite in the series, but it didn't live up to that hype. But then nothing probably would have. But this certainly leaves the door open to re-address Velma's explanation in the future if WB lets another writer take a shot at it. There was also no real meta prelude that some may have been over hopefully expecting, so this film makes me stand by the HB loose continuity idea.
The extended origin was cool for the chest, but admittedly the variety of the demons from the original show made it hard to pin down any kind of idea of when they were originally caught anyway. But it does make at least one of them kind of harsh in retrospect to curse the whole town over what just two guys did who may have not even been from there. But then again most dangerous demons in the world, so let's not expect them to play fair.
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