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Post by barneynedward on Nov 28, 2017 21:20:56 GMT -5
I'm working on story treatments for a Next generation series starring Shaggy and Velma's identical twin daughters and their son (Shaggy's and Velma's) as well as Fred and Daphne's son.
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Post by samcarter on Nov 29, 2017 10:51:54 GMT -5
Interesting idea, barneynedward. Keep writing. But what would you like to see in a show with the original gang?
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Post by russm on Nov 29, 2017 15:47:19 GMT -5
...I wanted to interact with fellow Scooby Doo fans, and see what you would like to see in a Scooby Doo show. Any suggestions? Guidelines? Ideas?
-Sam Carter As Austin Hourigan from YouTube's Shoddycast channel would say, let's SCIENCE the #@&*! out of this. 1. Do something positive with the characters of Fred and Velma. Their trajectories have gone from respectively a good-hearted goofball and happy nerdy eccentric (WNSD) to people who probably need to be in the adult social care system due to their levels of social dysfunction (SD:MI and to some extent BCSD). Don't carry on with this trajectory. 2. For the love of all that is holy, no SD:MI style relationship drama within the gang. Scooby Doo is not a soap opera, even less a teen-angst soap opera, do not make it one. If you want the gang to have relationships give them stable off-screen ones. 3. Unless ILM or Weta Workshop has your back you will be hamstrung by the laws of physics, most of what works in the cartoons will not work in live-action. You will need to steer away from this to more realistic aspects. 4. The Truth is Out There - the X-Files is probably the way to go. A light hearted version, but with overarching plots is probably the best way ahead. A focus on the gang investigating rather than the 'man in a mask’ bit; physics and budget will bite you if you try. 5. Scooby Doo is more than just Shaggy and Scooby eating or running about being scared. Give room for the other members to shine, give them their time in the sun, give the characters time to breathe. 6. Read Scooby Apocalypse and some of the earlier Scooby Doo Where Are You comics. For a break and for ideas (but not the current run of Where Are You as the writing is subpar.) 7. Be positive, Velma is curvy and chubby who is happy and confidant in herself Shaggy is tall and thin, a bit gangly his scaredy-ness is more than skin-deep but inside is the heart of a lion when the need arises, Daphne is a focused, intelligent and caring individual, the 'heart’ of the gang not a Fred-obsessed peril magnet. Fred is the leader, not a dictator, he knows when to step aside and let someone else work and he cares for the rest of the gang. 8. And decide what to do with Scooby. Is he just a dog, a dog with a voiceover (Disney animal journey films anyone?) or a 'smart dog’ as in Scooby Apocalypse. In many ways he will be the toughest nut to crack. Get him wrong and nothing else will matter. 9. Decide your audience, again X-FILES, it's not for children but not 18+ horror either. |
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Post by barneynedward on Nov 29, 2017 17:23:04 GMT -5
Interesting idea, barneynedward. Keep writing. But what would you like to see in a show with the original gang? In my Vision for it Shaggy, Velma, Fred and Daphne are major characters. It's just that the mysteries are solved by their kids. In season one, Velma is pregnant with Triplets. |
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Post by rightinthetockles on Nov 29, 2017 17:57:45 GMT -5
I understand your previous work in live adaptations have been very successful authentically speaking however I cannot say the same for Scooby-Doo. Getting the look correct would be but one step in the right direction, even if you captured the look of the cartoons exactly you would still run into issues. I can tell you shooting for something story heavy is what has been done in the past and it has not worked well. I suggest you approach it softly, but in a way that keeps your immersed and not bored. Stranger Things-esque is fine but build up to the twists and scares don't jump on them right away. Regarding specific obstacles, the CG has been very uncanny previously and making Scooby-Doo look right in three dimensions would be a very good thing to be certain of. I will site Night of 100 Frights for it's model, they do the proportions quite well and the shape isn't too sharp or too rounded. www.models-resource.com/playstation_2/scoobydoonightof100frights/model/10221/I don't have many guidelines but ideas are in abundance. Considering you site Stephen King I imagine you want to take it in a horror direction. Even with the original series Who's S-S-Scared? Scooby Doo has had trouble issuing dark tones and themes and we still have the problem in recent years. I'm not saying Time Warner won't let you but they don't enjoy twisting things up very much so keep this in mind when trying new things out. Look into fan favorites for insparation, Mystery Incorporated was controversial in the fandom for going too far and more specifically, the shipping. Take notes from movies like on Zombie Island, Legend of the Phantosaur, and the Witch's Ghost but also take notes on what not to do from the ones strongly considered silly or goofy like meets the Boo Brothers, The 13 Ghosts of, A Pup Named. Personally I think allusions would be fun but don't get too crazy, go for obscure ones that would be unnoticeable otherwise because it's uncanny to see references you don't get. Conclusively, approach the theme very softly, be sure to keep things minimalist not only for brand recognition but also for aesthetic purposes, and most importantly show don't tell.
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Post by rightinthetockles on Nov 29, 2017 18:03:12 GMT -5
But what would you like to see in a show with the original gang? This to me is a very good sign that you know what you're doing. In order to really get a good sense of realism you need to stay true to the roots. |
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Post by rightinthetockles on Nov 29, 2017 18:33:39 GMT -5
...I wanted to interact with fellow Scooby Doo fans, and see what you would like to see in a Scooby Doo show. Any suggestions? Guidelines? Ideas?
-Sam Carter 5. Scooby Doo is more than just Shaggy and Scooby eating or running about being scared. Give room for the other members to shine, give them their time in the sun, give the characters time to breathe. 6. Read Scooby Apocalypse and some of the earlier Scooby Doo Where Are You comics. For a break and for ideas (but not the current run of Where Are You as the writing is subpar.) 7. Be positive, Velma is curvy and chubby who is happy and confidant in herself Shaggy is tall and thin, a bit gangly his scaredy-ness is more than skin-deep but inside is the heart of a lion when the need arises, Daphne is a focused, intelligent and caring individual, the 'heart’ of the gang not a Fred-obsessed peril magnet. Fred is the leader, not a dictator, he knows when to step aside and let someone else work and he cares for the rest of the gang. 8. And decide what to do with Scooby. Is he just a dog, a dog with a voiceover (Disney animal journey films anyone?) or a 'smart dog’ as in Scooby Apocalypse. In many ways he will be the toughest nut to crack. Get him wrong and nothing else will matter. I completely agree russm, Make the characters relate-able. The trend recently is to dumb things down and make Shaggy hungry and scared, Fred egocentric and stupid, Daphne pretty and feminine, Velma expositious and forced. These are the traits of the gang but they are so simplified they become philosophical zombies. Instead, the idea in a horror series would be to give the motives so it all makes sense. Why is Shaggy hungry and scared? Does he have an eating disorder, does he believe in the super natural? Why is Fred blindly leading? Does something drive him to this or does someone? etc. Deductively explain who these characters are before launching them into the classic trope. I'm not saying you have to do an origins episode, in fact I'd prefer it to be anything but that; instead give us this with an introduction and focus on visual hints. Maybe even use visual hints later on for dramatic irony, what if Shaggy and Scooby find a clue but don't even realize it? It's supposed to be a mystery, give me something to solve. Another thing is comics. Comics are amazing and don't get any credit or source in the limelight. "earlier Where Are You" does not mean Golden Key. I like the Golden Key ones, they are nice adaptations of the original cartoon but russum is talking about the 1995 issues by Archie. This brings Scrappy in to question but yes Archie is very good; Alternate dogs (like Scrappy or Dum) are an entirely different thread, so I digress. The problem with insinuating such a thing is that there are many comics and many issues. A list of good issues would be a good thing to ask for if you really want comics but it would be a very long poll. EDIT: I was mistaken, they meant Golden Key, though this makes me confused. The dog will be there, he will be in it and the pressure is real. In WAY he doesn't talk much, when alternate dogs were introduced (Scrappy and Dum again) he talked a little more, In BC and MI he won't shut up. We've approached this many ways and I don't know what's the right way with this one. You're on your own, but don't screw it up. |
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Post by rightinthetockles on Nov 29, 2017 19:56:47 GMT -5
First of all, let me thank you for your thoughtful replies. One thing that will make this show easy to pitch is how devoted and loyal the fan base is. [1] As for story, the plot moves forward with [3] surprising pace, but the characters are front-and-center. They are the most important aspect of the scripts I am working on. I did want to make more of a horror slant with the series. No gore, but atmospheric horror with scary visuals. I LOVE the atmosphere [2] of the original cartoon. I also love the neo-retro atmosphere of Mystery Incorporated. In many ways, the show will be a blend of the SDWAY and Mystery Incorporated, with many new twists added. Unfortunately for some of you, I already have romantic relationships [4] between the characters outlined. It's necessary. The B and C plots are really what drive a show episode to episode, but don't fear: I hate soap-opera drama. I prefer writing more subtle relationship tension as opposed to sappy, dialogue-heavy conflict. Scooby Doo is a tricky character to write, especially since I was going for a more realistic (but fun and familiar) approach to the show. I decided that Scooby will have a more limited vocabulary (still able to say 'Ruh-roh, Raggy'), and will gain the ability to speak halfway through the series as a side effect of a supernatural disease. [7] I needed a time period with limited technology to set the story in, so I went for 1966 California. (I know, SDWAY was set in 1969, but this will pay homage to that cartoon.) [6] It will be a little tricky, since less people are familiar with the decade, as opposed to the 1980's (It, Stranger Things) [5] , but I think it will give the show a great atmosphere, and a snappy soundtrack choice. (Spooky – Dusty Springfield, Season of the witch – Donovan, Boris the spider – The Who, Bad Moon Rising – Creedence Clearwater Revival, Strangers in the Night – Frank Sinatra.) I've swan-dived into researching 60's pop-culture, slang, and fashion. [8] Fun fact: Strangers in the Night – Frank Sinatra inspired the name "Scooby Doo." Again, I've only been working on these scripts for about a week [9], and I'm not even getting paid for them yet. It isn't too late to input suggestions. I'll be busy this summer as I am joining another writing team, so I'll try to finish at least 8 episodes before then. Thank you, -Sam Carter Before I begin picking this apart I want to thank you for already making this interesting. I've always said the most important part of art is to get people's attention and that is what you have done. [1] Pace is something I bring up lots of times in critiquing Be Cool as you may have noticed. I do this as a personal note to WAY. The slow pace made it easier for the younger audience but I believe if put into something quite story heavy it would allow atmosphere [2] to be more of a breaking point for character build or maybe even a break from the chaos. [3] "Surprising" does not describe it well enough but my hope is that you intend to start slow and then speed up as it progresses. [4] Very bad. Keeping this 'necessary' stigma really makes this seem unsafe. I honestly believe the sexual tension is way too easy to screw up for it to be tried again, however I believe it to be possible; I want to be optimistic, as worried as this makes me so a good bit of this will be backpedaling. Romance would be good to add if you make it less about their attachment and more about their innocence. The gang may be very calm and collected at times but they're still teenagers. Make the relationships loose in the context of the series and make it more about becoming mature. [5] Though I have not seen Stranger Things, It (in regards to the novel anyway) made the 'romance' end more about them not knowing any better and less about traditional romance. Lots of people like to bring up the orgy part of the novel for shock humor but in truth this was to signify that the sexual tensions were over and they had symbolically become adults. Don't put a sex scene in that's not my point, the idea is to ground it in what teen love really is, a blind approach with only assumptions to go off of without any real experience. [6] I don't know that your demographic will notice a three year gap that far back, so you might as well go for it. Again, it makes me confident you keep the source in such high regard. [7] I'm most on the fence about this. On one end I still don't really know about what Scooby-Doo should be aside from voice and goofy actions (like charades to explain when he's too scared to talk or animating his tail as a finger) and on the other end I don't believe it should be grounded by something supernatural. Maybe this could be like Zombie Island where some super natural dudes are good and some are evil. (it's a 10 year spoiler but a good example) and I would like that. If it's by accident or through something possessing him (like the singularity in MI), there are just a little too many ways that could be and I would need specifics before truly saying something on it. [8] speaking of old spoilers, I'll be honest with you that isn't the coolest sign. It's possible not everyone knows still, but it being a very 'google'able thing makes me loose some hope. I guess when I asked for the references to not be TooMuch I should have said not to little either. [9] Whatever you do, I am interested to see the net result and will be following the information regarding it. Thank you again for keeping the board interesting, it can get very lonely when all you have is fellow fans and speculation. |
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Post by masqueradesfox on Nov 29, 2017 19:58:59 GMT -5
I wanted to interact with fellow Scooby Doo fans, and see what you would like to see in a Scooby Doo show. Any suggestions? Guidelines? Ideas?
-Sam CarterAs a life long Scooby fan and collector the biggest thing for me would be to please keep the gang relatable. Its something I think is often lost when people use the gang. They are a group of friends, real teens, having a good time solving mysteries. Each of them had aspects that anyone could relate too and it took the older series to a whole new level. They are not simple characters at all and a lot has been built up about them.The characters arent just surface level and they CANT be watered down. They are dynamic characters. They do learn, they all serve a purpose and all contribute to the group. When episodes showed the gang as dynamic it was the best thing ever. Too see Shaggy assess a clue and Velma crack a fun joke. If thats lost, the series as a Scooby-Doo series is lost to me. Please no love interests within the gang, its so overplayed. Friends can hang out and just be friends. Thats ok. Thats what the gang is to me at least. It gets so cliched so quickly, and again, ruins that dynamic. As for a darker type of Scooby series im sure it was bound to happen. For me not my thing, but I can totally get why people want it. But I definetly feel like it is not a horror/gory kind of franchise. Darker yes. But blood and gore no. I think there is a lot of give in format of a scooby series (doesnt need to be every episode one wrapped up mystery) as long as those core things like the gangs personality are intact, but some kind of mystery needs to be there obviously. And just a small one, but honestly would mean so much, please have the Mystery Machine, and leave it as it should be, a beat up little van decked out in funky colours. All that preachy mess said, I look forward to see Scooby expanding I just hope we dont lose its base in the process! |
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Post by masqueradesfox on Nov 29, 2017 22:15:28 GMT -5
There is not a screenwriter I know who is more committed to servicing the fans of Scooby Doo. I will make sure that the series does not mess with the details that make the show so popular. Everything you love about Scooby Doo will be left intact masqueradesfox, the Mystery Machine will be the same classic design. Only for the first 2/3 of the season, it will not have the words "Mystery Machine" painted on it. The rest of the paint-job is left intact. Forgive me if I come across rude here. But im not quite sure about some of the things you are saying. To begin with you came for input, but appear to have all this figured out and written. So is there room for our input here? And if you are "servicing" us, which is a pretty big claim, how can that apply if there is no wiggle room? for the Mystery machine are you saying its the same but without the words until its added later? Or did I mess up the wording there? Sorry just seems a bit strange to me. |
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Post by somebody-doo on Nov 29, 2017 22:26:14 GMT -5
I really loved what jcb did in Be Cool Scooby-Doo where the characters all had real personalities. Also, what I always wanted to see was a series with scary monsters where it's actually creepy and stuff but still with somebody behind it. I wrote lots of fanmade scripts with a really strange version of Scooby's character I would love to see, but should probably savw that in case I ever get a chance to create my own Scooby series. |
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Post by samcarter on Nov 29, 2017 22:41:50 GMT -5
I don't regard your comments as any personal offense. I encourage you to express your ideas openly and freely, as long as you remain logical, persuasive, tactful, and respectful.
Your input is greatly appreciated. I have ordered copies of Scooby Apocalypse volumes 1 and 2 and the first issues of the comic SDWAY, added X-Files and Legend of the Phantosaur to my watchlist, decided to keep easter eggs and references to a minimum for aesthetic purposes, decided to wait on executing certain plot twists until later in the season, decided to reengineer the show's pace for more buildup, and have decided to make Daphne a more intelligent sleuth, all because of your suggestions. You have also inspired me to make Scooby Doo a more central figure with a clear purpose.
As for the "Mystery Machine" logo, it does not make sense for the words to be on the van until later in season 1. It will be a good reveal. The rest of the van's paint job will be the same. It's a van that becomes a Mystery Machine. It undergoes character development as if it were a character itself.
The relationships between the characters have always been there, ever since SDWAY. They were downplayed since it was more of a kids show. Also, if I don't include romance somewhere in my scripts, no matter how well-written they are, they will be shot down by studio/network executives . . . or worse, the love subplots will be added in by other writers during the many draft revisions. The best thing I can do is handle it with grace and creativity in a way that doesn't hinder the group dynamic. Plus, it services the story to add that dynamic.
What I would like to know is if there are any dialogue lines, character moments, plot points, or jokes you would like to see in the show. Any favorite characters? Which villains would you like to see? Any original villain or story ideas?
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Post by rightinthetockles on Nov 29, 2017 22:48:46 GMT -5
"Any suggestions? Guidelines? Ideas?"
Then Later...
"Unfortunately for some of you, I already have romantic relationships between the characters outlined. It's necessary."
While this is but one example, it's still pretty concerning an entire thread agrees something is unjust and you lay out it will be in your project that you asked for out input on.
I would like to "keep up the discussion!" but eventually you run out of things you're legally allowed to leak and we run out of theories to make. I will say this though, in my eyes the whole concept of 'sex violence and drugs' being evil is pretty socially influenced. It's still information and should be regarded as reality, that being said you shouldn't force it in either. If shipping is 'necessary' or anything for that matter, you kinda ruin the natural feeling of a story. So let's say you do enter into romance in this, what is to be gained? How long can you really explore this before you hit a barrier? Because that's what censorship is, barriers. I guess what I'm trying to say is if you really want a realistic, immersive, scary show you need to make it feel natural. I won't go into a spiel about underlying plots because you work on Your Pretty Face which is drunk on underlying plot, however allow me to reference something most agree is the best Scooby thing ever. Zombie Island wasn't cool because the monsters are real, it's cool because it took that idea and said, the zombies were just trying to help them the entire time which sums up to, "Don't judge a book by it's cover." If you plan to have both romance and the supernatural, how can you hope to both tie those together and create a good message? Maybe you have that figured out, maybe shipping is mandatory in that case, but I don't find it very possible. I want to have hope for Scooby-Doo again, I want to believe it's not self fueled merchandise, but when they're literally making movies about toys about tv shows (Haunted Hollywood) it's really hard to deny. Maybe Pan-Pizza was right, there's just way too much Scooby-Doo. How about we take a nice, well deserved break? That won't happen, but I can dream.
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Post by masqueradesfox on Nov 29, 2017 22:59:08 GMT -5
Thank you for clearing that up.
Glad to see you were taking some things into consideration! I just saw more defending of your ideas then taking note of those changes in your reply. But very glad to see them listed out and expanding.
I was pretty sure thats what you meant about the mystery machine just wasnt totally sure. That makes sense.
Im always optimistic about Scooby stuff and will hold you to the high standards you have set for yourself. I dont agree with the relationships being there from the beginning, and likely never will, but if yours are just as subtle as you say then it shouldnt be much to get used too.
I always expect Scooby as a franchise to change an develop, but its how the gang is presented that makes it a Scooby-Doo show or someone elses story using Scoobys name for me. I will continue to follow this closly. As you acknowledged, we are devoted fans. :3
P.S. I know its a long shot, but I always loved Googie as a character and wanted to see more of her.
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Post by rightinthetockles on Nov 29, 2017 23:07:11 GMT -5
I don't regard your comments as any personal offense. I encourage you to express your ideas openly and freely, as long as you remain logical, persuasive, tactful, and respectful. Your input is greatly appreciated. I have ordered copies of Scooby Apocalypse volumes 1 and 2 and the first issues of the comic SDWAY, added X-Files and Legend of the Phantosaur to my watchlist, decided to keep easter eggs and references to a minimum for aesthetic purposes, decided to wait on executing certain plot twists until later in the season, [2] decided to reengineer the show's pace for more buildup, and have decided to make Daphne a more intelligent sleuth, all because of your suggestions. You have also inspired me to make Scooby Doo a more central figure with a clear purpose. [3]As for the "Mystery Machine" logo, it does not make sense for the words to be on the van until later in season 1. It will be a good reveal. The rest of the van's paint job will be the same. It's a van that becomes a Mystery Machine. It undergoes character development as if it were a character itself. [1]What I would like to know is if there are any dialogue lines, character moments, plot points, or jokes you would like to see in the show. Any favorite characters? Which villains would you like to see? Any original villain or story ideas?
[2] I can't tell much difference because I didn't have an idea of the pace from before but it sounds like a good change.
[3] Lake Monster/ Mystery Begins tried to have the Mystery Machine be a big reveal too. I'm sorry but it's just too bluntly obvious. As for the whole 'character' thing I'm again inspired by how general that wording is, because that could really mean anything but contracts suck.
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